another cam thread...

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mjoyner408

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i know i have seen several cam threads but i cannot find much on the 509 purple shafts. i have one sitting on the shelf that i got with a pile of other crap. i hate to be "that guy" but i want to build a motor that just flat sounds nasty. i have heard some sound bites of the 509 and it definitely fits the bill. was leaning toward the mutha thumpa from comp but the 509 still sounds better and i have it already. my question is, what would be a good combination to run with this cam? i was thinking a torqer 2 intake, a 750 holley and maybe a home done polished set of 906's. i would love to get a set of stage 6's but that is not in the cards... or the bank, right now. i know there are better cams and new technology but i have this already and i am going for more of a poser/ head turner than a show nuff power house.

also, what is the lowest stall that will work with this cam?
 
I have a comp cams XE285 with large tube headers, a dual plane intake, 906 heads with a 750 DP and it sounds really nasty. However I am running domed pistons with 12:1 compression and 410's in the rear and it is a very nice combo. The only area of concern is the unleaded gas and in Canada the highest octane available is 93. I have been adding boost and have had not problems.
 
mjoyner408 said:
i know i have seen several cam threads but i cannot find much on the 509 purple shafts. i have one sitting on the shelf that i got with a pile of other crap. i hate to be "that guy" but i want to build a motor that just flat sounds nasty. i have heard some sound bites of the 509 and it definitely fits the bill. was leaning toward the mutha thumpa from comp but the 509 still sounds better and i have it already. my question is, what would be a good combination to run with this cam? i was thinking a torqer 2 intake, a 750 holley and maybe a home done polished set of 906's. i would love to get a set of stage 6's but that is not in the cards... or the bank, right now. i know there are better cams and new technology but i have this already and i am going for more of a poser/ head turner than a show nuff power house.

also, what is the lowest stall that will work with this cam?
Click to expand...

Check with Mopar Performance as to which converter will work best. I'd estimate a 2600 RPM stall or so. Make sure to get an aftermarket trans cooler, too, just to be on the safe side.
Ditch the Torker 2 - especially with a 383. On a 440 you'll be ok because of the additional torque the 440 produces. A better intake is the Performer RPM but then you get into hood clearance issues with the air cleaner assembly - unless you get the drop base unit from Jegs which workes very well. Better than the Torker II is the original Torker. It will make great power up to 5500 rpm which is great for a 440. A 383 needs to wind up to 6000-6500 to keep up with the 440. If you want another good single plane for a 383 or 440 then get a used Holley Street Dominator. These are very good intakes. Also, good vintage dual plane intakes would include the Edelbrock DP-4B for the 383 and the CH4B for the 440. Both make excellent power (almost as good as the Performer RPM) in the horsepower range you are dealing with.
Next you definitely want headers for max. horsepower. tti makes the absolute best there are IMO. They are expensive but well worth it. A 2.5" diameter exhaust system is the minimum size to use. Mandrel bent pipes are preferrable as is an "X" pipe, however, an H-pipe is acceptable. Mufflers are up to you. Flowmaster, Magnaflow, Dynomax, Thrush all make great selections. Why run stock manifolds if you are going to go with a cam like that? If that is the case just keep the stock intake manifold and carb, too. The car will ruin like crap but will sound like a killer.
Rear gears with that cam should be 3.55 or lower (3.91, 4.10, etc), 3.23's won't suit it too well with that cam unless you have a 440 and a 3200 rpm stall converter.
The Holley 750 is a good carb, no need for anything else.

If you aren't willing to step up and add some goodies to go with that cam then you really shouldn't be using it. Performance is all built on having the proper combination. Sure, it may sound like a Billy Bad *** but it will run like crap.
 
mcmopar said:
If you aren't willing to step up and add some goodies to go with that cam then you really shouldn't be using it. Performance is all built on having the proper combination. Sure, it may sound like a Billy Bad *** but it will run like crap.
Click to expand...

i sure did learn this the hard way.
 
mcmopar said:
Check with Mopar Performance as to which converter will work best. I'd estimate a 2600 RPM stall or so. Make sure to get an aftermarket trans cooler, too, just to be on the safe side.
Ditch the Torker 2 - especially with a 383. On a 440 you'll be ok because of the additional torque the 440 produces. A better intake is the Performer RPM but then you get into hood clearance issues with the air cleaner assembly - unless you get the drop base unit from Jegs which workes very well. Better than the Torker II is the original Torker. It will make great power up to 5500 rpm which is great for a 440. A 383 needs to wind up to 6000-6500 to keep up with the 440. If you want another good single plane for a 383 or 440 then get a used Holley Street Dominator. These are very good intakes. Also, good vintage dual plane intakes would include the Edelbrock DP-4B for the 383 and the CH4B for the 440. Both make excellent power (almost as good as the Performer RPM) in the horsepower range you are dealing with.
Next you definitely want headers for max. horsepower. tti makes the absolute best there are IMO. They are expensive but well worth it. A 2.5" diameter exhaust system is the minimum size to use. Mandrel bent pipes are preferrable as is an "X" pipe, however, an H-pipe is acceptable. Mufflers are up to you. Flowmaster, Magnaflow, Dynomax, Thrush all make great selections. Why run stock manifolds if you are going to go with a cam like that? If that is the case just keep the stock intake manifold and carb, too. The car will ruin like crap but will sound like a killer.
Rear gears with that cam should be 3.55 or lower (3.91, 4.10, etc), 3.23's won't suit it too well with that cam unless you have a 440 and a 3200 rpm stall converter.
The Holley 750 is a good carb, no need for anything else.

If you aren't willing to step up and add some goodies to go with that cam then you really shouldn't be using it. Performance is all built on having the proper combination. Sure, it may sound like a Billy Bad *** but it will run like crap.
Click to expand...

thanks for the info. that is exactly what i am looking for. i am not set on the intake. i have been eye'n the torker2 but i am not set on it. tti headers are on the list as well. i am just trying to get a feel for what i am lookng at for the motor. thanks for the help. i will do a little more poking around to se which stall they recomind. thanks again man.
 
I had a 509 cam in my 383 and it was a real disappointment. It did sound really good but the car ran like crap to the point that I didn't want to drive it. A couple of issues in my case were the tall gears, 3.23:1 and a pretty low compression (less than 9:1 I suspect) due to aftermarket pistons with a 4-speed manual transmission. If you use steep gears the car might be drivable at least.
 
i am going to put it in a 440. hopefully it will act a little better in the bigger motor. i honestly do not know what gears are in the car. it is an auto with the hp383. i would assume if it was anything other than standard it would be on the fender tag.
 
mjoyner408 said:
i am going to put it in a 440. hopefully it will act a little better in the bigger motor. i honestly do not know what gears are in the car. it is an auto with the hp383. i would assume if it was anything other than standard it would be on the fender tag.
Click to expand...

There's no good reason not to know the gear ratio...and you NEED TO if you're going to do this...especially with that old school, weak on the bottom-end camshaft. Jack it up, turn the driveshaft, count the # of driveshaft revolutions requierd to get the tires to do one full rotation. You'll know the gear ratio in a heartbeat... Jacking it up and putting it back on the ground will be the longest part of the process... If they're 3.23s or higher (lower numerical ratio) and you're keeping them then make sure you buy a REALLY loose converter... :D
 
It will work well in a 440 with the right combo (as Ray just pointed out). There is a guy around here that Jim (classracer) knows that has a B5 1970 GTX with the 440/.509" cam in it and it will do low 12's (12.20's) through the exhaust(!). I've personally seen this car run (moparmoose ran up against him one night at Orlando Speed World) and it flies! It has a column shift automatic and he just leaves it in drive for the run. It has a few mods of course (headers, trans, shift kit, high stall converter, etc.) and he runs 4.10 gears in it. Its a baaaad car and does well on the show field as well.
 
I have to stand with the 509. I think its a good cam, just misunderstood. I have run it in both a 440 and a 360. Obviously the 440 ran well and had great power. The 360 needed more finesse to get it there. The 360 had stock x heads and 7.823 to 1 compression, thats not a typo, stock cast crank and a single plane torker with a 750 holley. The 508 in the 360 had a power band that was very narrow 1800 rpm, but was very explosive, wheels up anyone? Since the car it was in had a 3500 stall, 4.56 gears, and mini tubbed with 10.5 slicks it was able to capitalize on that power band very well and ran just over 110 at 3150 pounds. This car ran very well and had great driving characteristics. Some of the things that I did that helped the vacuum situation was to lock out the mechanical advance in the ditributor and set the timing at 36. Next thing I did was lower the idle with the idle stop screw and open the secondaries till I achieved the desired idle using the little known secondary stop screw. These 2 things transitioned the car from frustrating to drive to exceptional. Of course I did the same thing to the 440 which had 10.5 to 1 and ran low 12s and high elevens on occassion at 114 mph with a 2200 stall and 3.55 gears at 3400 pounds. Just like Mac stated in another thread once you have the combo right anything can be sorted out to work. A lot of people try something and then give up when it doesn't work. Mopars are different and can be frustrating with trial and error tuning. On a side note I did give the 509 a thought in my six pack Super Bee I think it might work very well since I dont have any vacuum accessories and a stick.
 
thanks for all the info. i was disheartened when i initially read the ".509 purple cams suck on the street" threads. i will put some reserch time into this and with the right combo it sounds like it will fit the bill. thanks again for the help!
 
Recently MP made a more street friendly 509 cam with less overlap, making the cam more street friendly, but that won't help you since you already have the cam. A decent stall converter (2600-2800), a mild shift kit and some 3.55 or lower gears (3.91 or 4.10) will help your 509 get off the line nicely.
 
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