Roller lifters and roller cams question vs flat tappet

[nicanor]

I found someone to rebuild my engine. If I go with Crower (company he works with here in Southern CA) and we go with a hydraulic roller cam, does that mean I have to use the roller lifters as well or recommended. Is the roller cam and lifters just a remove the old flat tappet and install the new roller cam and lifters or is there more to it on a 383.

We have to tear the engine down to change the bearings flush the engine and see if there is any other damage to the engine so I was thinking roller cam and lifters this time.

Hopefully some gear heads can help me out because I would like to know this engine is going together correctly.

Thanks,
Barry

 

[ACME A12]

Yes, you have to use the roller lifters with the roller cam. Use whichever lifters the cam manufacturer recommends. This is just the easiest route. You can mix and match cams and lifters if you do this kind of engine work everyday, but since you don't just play it safe.

There is definitely more to it than just swapping out the cam and lifters...

Valve springs have to be changed. Rollers require more seat pressure due to their design.

Most Hydraulic Rollers are ground on steel billets so they are incompatible with original steel drive gears. If the cam is steel you will need to change to a bronze gear.

Most big block roller lifters do not require any oiling mods (unlike most small block versions which do) - but make sure that you buy a cam/lifter combo that states that no block mods are required just to be sure. I know Hughes & Comp both have lifters that are billed as drop-ins - not sure about the Crowers - maybe someone else knows.

This is just a start. Chris and others will add to my list.

 

[george68hemirr]

what Ray said

 

[ACME A12]

Forgot: Roller will probably have the three bolt snout on it, whereas your 383 probably has the one bolt. You'll likely need a new timing chain set too.

 

[69hemibeep]

What about rockers?

 

[ACME A12]

What about rockers?

I'd certainly prefer to have adjustable ones myself, and probably just run the ductile iron ones on the street. :cents:

 

[nicanor]

For a stock 383 with maybe a little more lift worth changing to roller cam/lifters? After this last lifter ground down and took the cam with it, I want to make sure it doesn't happen again. Need to get the engine right so that I can move on.

Thanks,
Barry

 

[ACME A12]

For a stock 383 with maybe a little more lift worth changing to roller cam/lifters? After this last lifter ground down and took the cam with it, I want to make sure it doesn't happen again. Need to get the engine right so that I can move on.

Thanks,
Barry

That will have to be your call...it's your car and your money... Plenty of us running flat tappets around here, that's for sure...

Nothing wrong with a flat tappet as long as you break it in properly and put a zinc additive in your oil...

 

[moparchris]

Crower has a very good reputation as being the BEST roller cam manufacturer out there. I run Crowers lifters even if I run a comp cam since most lifters are made in China these days but Crower is still made in the USA. I would run a hydraulic roller in any engine. The advantages are that the ramp on the cam lobe itself excellerates the valve open sooner and holds it open longer while retaining good street manners (idle quality, and good vacuum) I see it all the time where a 400hp motor with a flat tappet make 75 more HP with a proper roller. In a street mopar with stock parts I would run something in the 230 degree at .050 lift duration and in the .550 to .600 lift range. A stock Mopar 906 runs out of flow around .475 lift but dont let that fool you. The low lift (when the valve is starting to open) is where all your torque is made. 906s flow pretty well in the low lift range and the hydraulic roller will exploit that. After the cam has opened the valve higher than the choke point of the head (where it stops seeing an increase in flow despite the increase in lift) the head will spend more time at its max flow resulting in longer duration without the side effects. Then in the future when you want more power just pop off the heads and either replace with some Indy E-Zs or have your stock ones ported and whatch that 383 bust the 500 hp barrier. You absolutely roll peoples heads off when they get a ride then tell them that its just a 383. I have built this combo before and its impressive to watch a stock Road Runner run deep into the 11s.

On a side note to answer 69HemiBeeps question. A set of good roller rockers are mandatory at this point. With the spring pressures exceeding 400 pounds open the stock rockers would fold up in half the first time you tried to RPM it, same goes as well for the ductile iron ones. The ductile iron rockers are plenty strong but the friction point on the valve tip would wear out the rocker and valve very quickly. Since BBM have shaft rockers ( the things Chevy guys only dream about) a roller tip is all that is necessary. Oh and about the bronze gear business. I believe Crower (if not then I know other manufacturers have them) makes a hydraulic roller cam with a cast iron gear which eliminates the need for the bronze distributor gear and a stock on e can be used.

Clear as mud? Good that sounds about right.

 

[69hemibeep]

Thanks Chris lots of good info

 

[SomeCarGuy]

The Crower stuff will do well.

What do you plan to do with the car? Changing to a roller will cost $$$$$$ and the gains might not give you good return on investment. Putting the full roller setup in a pretty much stock engine will yield minimal gains.

If you go w/ aluminum heads, get them worked, buy nice headers, upgrade oil pan, etc, then it will be exponentially worth more than on a stocker freshening.

That MP cam likely died just because MP stuff tends to suck. A lot. A good quality cam and the right zinc filled oil will serve you well.

 

[moparchris]

Thanks Chris lots of good info

I kinda figured you would be interested in that info. Ray lambasted me for going into it and possibly selling the OP an expensive upgrade for a stock Runner and then asked me which crack dealer I got my $500 roller rockers from because he was sure that I am on crack.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CRN-64790-1/



BTW a roller will wake a stock motor up like you wont believe. 60hp and 50lb/ft, thats a bet I would take all day. :yesnod:

 

[69hemibeep]

Thanks Chris lots of good info

I kinda figured you would be interested in that info. Ray lambasted me for going into it and possibly selling the OP an expensive upgrade for a stock Runner and then asked me which crack dealer I got my $500 roller rockers from because he was sure that I am on crack.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CRN-64790-1/



BTW a roller will wake a stock motor up like you wont believe. 60hp and 50lb/ft, thats a bet I would take all day. :yesnod:

You might be on crack but you have some good insight on mopar internals, maybe because you can see through them on crack :crazy: :jester:

 

[ACME A12]

I kinda figured you would be interested in that info. Ray lambasted me for going into it and possibly selling the OP an expensive upgrade for a stock Runner and then asked me which crack dealer I got my $500 roller rockers from because he was sure that I am on crack.

BTW a roller will wake a stock motor up like you wont believe. 60hp and 50lb/ft, thats a bet I would take all day. :yesnod:

You might be on crack but you have some good insight on mopar internals, maybe because you can see through them on crack :crazy: :jester:

"Lambasted" might be a bit of a stretch here... But I'm shopping for rockers for Bambi's new engine myself so the roller rocker discussion is very timely from my perspective.

As for the upsides to roller cams, no one has to sell me on this. I have them in two of my cars and there is no better set-up for performance. But it all goes back to intended usage and benefit vs. cost. Like everything else...

:jester:

 

[moparchris]

I kinda figured you would be interested in that info. Ray lambasted me for going into it and possibly selling the OP an expensive upgrade for a stock Runner and then asked me which crack dealer I got my $500 roller rockers from because he was sure that I am on crack.

BTW a roller will wake a stock motor up like you wont believe. 60hp and 50lb/ft, thats a bet I would take all day. :yesnod:

You might be on crack but you have some good insight on mopar internals, maybe because you can see through them on crack :crazy: :jester:

"Lambasted" might be a bit of a stretch here... But I'm shopping for rockers for Bambi's new engine myself so the roller rocker discussion is very timely from my perspective.

As for the upsides to roller cams, no one has to sell me on this. I have them in two of my cars and there is no better set-up for performance. But it all goes back to intended usage and benefit vs. cost. Like everything else...

:jester:

Both those cars are Chevies aren't they? :lock: The cost doesn't count when we talk Chevy. ot:

 

[ACME A12]

:facepalm: