Im looking at a '69 roadrunner. Fender tag, dash vin, and engine stamp all match the title. But the numbers stamped into the rad support and trunk lip are off by two. Von ends in 395. Rad support and trunk lid end in 393. The car has been in storage for 25 years. Rad support and trunk lid start with G9 and end in 393. But engine block, fender tag, and dash vin start with RM21H and end in 395. Did someone swap an engine/tranny, fender tag, and dash tag into a satellite? Need an answer fast!
HELP fast!
- Thread starter w8kbrder
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droptop
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The rad support and the trunk lip do not have the full vin on them. They have the letter for the build factory (G in this case for St. Louis) and the 6 numbers on the vin. Sounds like a re-body to me. :cents:
Basketcase
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sumthin fishy there
Big John
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So... It's exactly 2 off?
As in 100393 and 100395?
The chances of two cars coming together after being driven off the assembly line are pretty slim... Let alone two cars being involved in a rebody. I'll bet it a factory screw up.... But what does it do for the legality/resale? I don't know, but I'd be really cautious.
As in 100393 and 100395?
The chances of two cars coming together after being driven off the assembly line are pretty slim... Let alone two cars being involved in a rebody. I'll bet it a factory screw up.... But what does it do for the legality/resale? I don't know, but I'd be really cautious.
Big John said:
You are correct. Its exactly 2 off just as you stated. I was thinking the same thing as the chances of two cars coming off the assembly line right next to each other, then being combined 10 years later...or maybe less (car was stored since 1983..still had the license tag/registration for that year). The car has everything that the Fender Tag states. All of the interior colors/bench seat/engine/ext color/fender mounted turn signals, etc match up. The engine/tranny, fender tag, dash vin, and title all match (sequence code ends in 395). The Radiator support and trunk lip have the exact same sequence code, except for the last digit (393), which is off by two.
I spent 3 solid hours looking over everything, under the dash, signs of being wrecked/altered etc. The dash and everything behind it looks original including all of the air conditioning/heater duct work/wiring. From the looks of it, it looks all original as if no one has touched any of the mounting screws or places that would show signs of being removed/replaced at some point. Even the color roadrunner on the dash looks original and not an aftermarket type thing. The car was in storage since 1983 so it has a lot of debris stuffed in the nooks and crannies from field mice. I opened the glove box and its slammed full of rats nests.
So heres what I'm thinking:
A.) If it was cloned in the murky past.....why would someone take so much time effort to turn a satellite into a roadrunner with all the parts stated in the fender tag pre-1983 when these cars were not worth what they are today? Why wouldn't someone drop in a 440 or hemi.
B.) What are the chances of finding a donor roadrunner and a satellite body that are only two digits off from the factory sequence code? The chances of that are like winning the lottery.
Regardless it runs great, tranny shifts great...original gas tank and radiator.
69hemibeep
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Sounds like a factory snafu to me.
roadrunnerh
Well-Known Member
I would be cautious but I wouldn't necessarily pass on it. What kind of condition is this car? How much cash are we talking about? Seems like it was a factory screw up.
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roadrunnerh said:
Overall the car is in pretty good shape. The majority of time he owned it, its been in storage in a warehouse. It was outside for a few months in the early 90s. Body is straight and all the original metal is there....rear lower quarters and the trunk pan need to be replaced. Other than that, a few little surface spots here and there. All the floor pans are original and there with no rust. Dash is intact including all gauges/lighting/AC controls. But entire interior needs to be redone. New headliner, carpet, recover the seats, new door cards, etc. Easy stuff there. But it still has all the original interior so I know how to match it exactly.
Engine runs great on the original carb, orig radiator and orig gas tank. All the lights work. It has the "voice of the roadrunner' beep beep horn and that works as well. Really just needs a lot of cosmetics. The prev owner had put a new exhaust, water pump, hoses, belt, boiled out the gas tank and radiator just to get it up and running again. Back glass was broken out but he gave me a spare back glass. Passenger side roll up window is missing. He told me it sat outside for a few months back in the early 90's and some kids broke out the back glass and passenger window. Windshield is cracked as well. Only thing missing engine-wise is the A/C compressor and I have a spare one. I ended up buying it. It runs, drives, and sounds great. Just needs a lot of cosmetics and cleaning. I'm pretty excited to finally become a Roadrunner family member.
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and just so you'll feel at home here Mr New road runner owner.....
RoadRunnerJD
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Pictures please and what options?
droptop
Well-Known Member
What size are the brakes, and is there a sway bar on the front? These are 2 common items that are over looked when cloning a car.
droptop said:
Yes there is a sway bar and I'm not sure about the exact size of the brakes as I didn't look. I am going to pick it up with a trailer this weekend. The only oddity that I can find is the V1W code for a white vinyl top. When the guy I bought it from bought it back in the early 80's, the man he purchased it from had re-painted it once...sometime in the late 70s or around 1980. Now, if it truly had a vinyl top, then it was removed and painted over. Thats the only thing I could find. At the time I didn't look to see if someone had spot welded the holes where the chrome would have attached between the back glass chrome and the roof drip rail chrome.
Everything else seems to match up and the man I bought it from definitely didn't do any kind of swap in recent years because the thing has about 25 years of filth and rats nests in the dash. It has three decades worth of grime on it. If someone did do a clone prior to circa 1984ish, then they went through some painstaking processes to get it right. But wouldn't it have been easier to just buy a Roadrunner at that point in time? Those cars would have only been roughly a decade old at that time and I imagine you could find them fairly easy? Plus the fact that the sequence number being off by two would be near impossible to find. So at this point, I'm not sure what the deal is. I will post a few pics once I pick it up. Regardless it will be fun to drive once I clean it up and do some cosmetics.
Here's a few of the options that the fender tag lists:
B7
Paint Code: Medium Blue Metallic
M2B
Trim Grade/Style/Color
M = Medium
2 = Vinyl Bench
B = Light Blue
B7 Upper Door Frame: Medium Blue Metallic
428 Date Built: 4 / 28 / 1969
G33 Left Hand Outside Mirror - Manual / Chrome
H51 Single Air /w Heater
L31 Hood / Fender Mount Turn Signal
M21 Roof Drip Rail Moldings
R11 Music Master Radio AM
B7 Medium Blue Metallic
V1W Full Vinyl Top - White
26 26 in. Radiator
A01 Light Package
Roadcuda
Well-Known Member
When I first got my car it didn't have a Vinyl roof. Once I figured out it should have come with it a friend had me open the trunk so he could reach the inside of the lower c pillar where the holes for the trim would be. He could feel the material that was used to fill in the trim holes on both sides of the car so we were confident that it came with the vinyl roof. That was all I need to know as I wanted to put one back on the car and I'm very happy with the way the car looks now.
mcmopar
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Congrats on the purchase. Sounds like a cool car and a great story to go with it.
generaljmwlee
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even a beat up bird is a pretty bird to look at!
Basketcase
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Nice score! Enjoy! :cheers: